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Josh

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The last few weeks have been interesting as we've been figuring out where Leadwerks 3 fits into the game development landscape.

 

The good:

  • The feedback from the Leadwerks 3 users has been more positive than anything I've ever seen. People love using it. All the care and attention to the tools has really paid off. The return of constructive solid geometry is a huge win.
  • At the upgrade pricing, we're doing a lot of sales. Leadwerks 3 makes more in a week than Leadwerks 2 made in a month, at its best. (Our best sales are typically in the middle of the product life cycle, not the beginning.)
  • Leadwerks 3 has a much wider appeal than anything we've ever made. We're no longer trapped in a small niche, but we still have the expandability to reclaim the crown of high-end graphics.

 

The bad:

  • Indie developers can't afford the full price we hoped to set. It doesn't matter what features we add to the product, there's a certain price threshold we can't cross without a multi-million dollar marketing budget.
  • Although our documentation is excellent, people still need a full "how to make a game" series of tutorials. The "Darkness Awaits" example game isn't enough, without being put into a tutorial format.

 

My original idea for Leadwerks 3 was to make a premium product, with a premium price. I was counting on revenue to come primarily from existing Leadwerks users, because it's easier to sell to an existing customer than to attain a new one. However, it's clear that Leadwerks 3 has mass appeal like nothing we've ever done, and a lot of potential for growth if we price it right. Indie developers are happy to buy Leadwerks 3 at an affordable price point. I think there are enough indie developers out there to support us, so we're making the final price $199/199/199 across the board for new customers. Our other market segment are pro game studios, and for them we can offer source code licenses (at a much higher price). Selling a binary license that's too expensive for indies and too cheap for studios is an awkward positioning, and I don't think it works.

 

When we get back from the GDC, Chris is going to be taken off the core engine development and put exclusively on end user lessons. We are planning a series of weekly tutorials taking you through the steps to make a full first-person shooter game with Leadwerks 3. We chose this genre because we think the precision of the controls maximizes the potential for interactions, which is where Leadwerks 3 can really shine. I will be focused on core engine and editor fixes, and new features.

 

Leadwerks 3 has a wide enough appeal that I think we can count on growth to fuel the company, not high prices. Leadwerks 3.1 will be the next stop. I know graphical enhancements are a high priority for a lot of people, as well as gameplay features and editor enhancements.

 

It is an exciting time when the only limits you have are the size of your ideas and the degree of your dedication. We're already seeing some incredible stuff come from the community with Leadwerks 3.

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I've today upgraded my LW2 license to LW3 and LW3iOS (300$ total) which is a bargain and you'll see how quickly it pay off to offer agressive low prices. ;)

 

We've spend 7500$ in Unity4 licenses and will soon become obsolete when v5 arrives next year. That's painful. We will possibly stick all the way with LW if version 3.2 comes before our current project is done and forget about Unity for a while. Unity start to become really expensive. Plus the fact that i can finaly code nativelly in C++, more reasons to stick with LW3!

 

Yeah, definatelly we need a how to videos/tutorials in the comming weeks.

PS: Waiting for my invoice to be completed. tongue.png

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Josh just to clarify, you state its $199/199/199? Is that $199 for PC and $199 each for ios & android module.

 

Or is that $199 for 3.0, $199 for 3.1 and $199 for 3.2?

 

Andy

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I definitely think this is a perfect pricing model. I just bought the Mac version and iOS version. I look forward to playing with it tonight.

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i thought you said that LE2 users would have the lowered price until April 30th? and now its been raised $200 more for the total package...

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Guest Red Ocktober

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yeah... this must be the public release prices for new users... at least i hope so...

 

last time i looked (this morning?) i could've sworn i saw $199, $99 and $99 respectively for LE2 users upgrading to LE3 licenses...

 

i'm so confused... someone please gimme the straight and skinny...

 

--Mike

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What's excellent about it ... I think Josh is playing the old gypsy cup trick here with all the price changes and no one can see the wood for the trees.

 

For an existing LE2 user no price reduction on upgrading to just the Windows version! So that's a big thank you to all your previous LE2 windows only developers.

 

But wait, it gets better. What about those who bought LE2 on the basis that Josh promised it would be cheaper to do that and upgrade than buy just LE3 new. Well they really got hit because it just cost them $200 more to get LE3 base than a new user. You can do the rest of the math yourselves, but trust me, they don't gain anything at all but loose at every stage apart from simply breaking even if they upgrade to all three.

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Great strategic position.

 

I received some Unity advert telling me that Unity 4 basic and Android or IOS basic for 400$ is awesome deal. Are they spying LE 3 forums or blogs ? It just prooves some others indie 3D engines have leraned it and begun frightenned :)

 

Yep LE3 Lua script system is amazing ,even if im' not good coder or bad at maths (Thanks to Crhis for all is detailled long explanations)

 

For tutorials, well why not FPS.

It is strategic to appeal FPS Creators users ?

Caus i would like to see racing system in the future.

 

I hope to see BSP smoothing for lightmaps soon ;)

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Perhaps LE2 users could have some good discount on some future big evolution ?(LE 3.5 or LE 4)

 

Yes LE 2 users won't get anything special this time.

But perhaps it's just a real break between LE2 and LE3 and turn the page for totally new product in some sort.

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I received some Unity advert telling me that Unity 4 basic and Android or IOS basic for 400$ is awesome deal. Are they spying LE 3 forums or blogs ? It just prooves some others indie 3D engines have leraned it and begun frightenned smile.png

 

er... except unity has had that price for at least a year... again stop it with the silly fanboy bollocks... you were already called out for that in this post a couple of days ago:

http://www.leadwerks...rts/#entry53010

 

if anything I would say LE is affected by the unity pricing not the other way around, as this pricing was brought up when LE3 cost $1500 to $3000

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I'm not advertiser or fanboy of any engine.

 

I know the price is from years, what was strange is the focus on mobile only in the mail advert and for the cheaper solution at 400$, Caus they made adverts but for engine , now they focused on mobile advert , just strange.

 

Forget it , i think i got it that time:

Forget 3D engines and make a game instead.

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I can't think of a worse way to learn than from a full example game. It's a good way to get your brain stuck in a box... learning the tricks and never really learning the concepts.

 

@YouGroove: Have you ever noticed that when you buy a new car then you often notice the same model of the car on the road a lot more often.... same thing happening here......

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@mockingbird, did you ever use the downloader for LE2 because if so it should still be in there. That's where I took mine from.

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