The constructive Linux thread

[CreativeOcclusion]

I see what you mean NA....you know your in a crazy place when you see pigs wearing sunglasses....Not you Josh, I was talking about DerRidda....

[gamedeviancy]

Scrolling in the script editor and asset tree works fine but the actual asset browser with the little previews, scene tree, entity properties and view port scroll bars don't work with the mouse. It works for you in all these places? If in doubt, the AI and Events tutorial map is rich enough in just about everything to see a scroll bar there.

 

I wonder why we can't have the scroll bar that is in the asset tree anywhere else.

 

I see what you mean there... Mousewheel doesn't operate the scrollbar in that window pane. Odd. I can click and drag the scrollbar slider fine....

[Ronald Buanno]

Gamedeviancy, your avatar I feel like is one upping mine, its just... perfect lol. I literally feel like you have mastered the look xD I can't tell if thats your hair, a towel, or a wig? But its workin lol

 

Also, yes there are wacky scrolling issues with the leadtwerks.

[Josh]

Let's do some triage.

 

High priority

• Model editor rendering bug has now been reported to Nvidia here.
  

 

Medium priority

• F1 / Help uses hardcoded browser the user may not have (firefox) and will lock the editor if no previous instance is running I saw some documentation on xdg or something and my eyes just glazed over. Does anyone have a simple C command to retrieve the browser executable path or open a URL in the preferred browser?
  
• Scene tab is broken I'm not sure how to proceed with this one, but it is a significant annoyance.
  

 

Low priority

• F12 (single viewport mode) not working I don't think this is critical, and the feature works really badly with GTK.
  
• Tooltips not working Should be fixed, but I don't consider this a big deal.
  
• Changing editor fontsize results in crash This has been disabled to prevent problems. It may be enabled at some point, but I wouldn't call the lack of this feature a show-stopper.
  
• Drag & Drop doesn't work anywhere. It doesn't work in between windows, and alternate control methods have been devised to deal with this. I'm not even sure if drag-and-drop is a good control scheme, since it is not visually obvious at all. I'll never forget how many hours I wasted trying to figure out how to apply a material in 3ds max for the first time.
  
• Mouse wheel doesn't work any where It doesn't work in the scene browser or asset browser. Slightly annoying but only that.
  
• UTF-8 paths breaks the editor This is not intended to be supported.
  

[Naughty Alien]

I see what you mean NA....you know your in a crazy place when you see pigs wearing sunglasses....Not you Josh, I was talking about DerRidda....

 

..i just noticed that tons of guys having those hats and sunglasses, and on the top of that, somehow, facial expressions on their avatars (which i knew from before), blended on to whole thing on such way that I cant stop laughing when i see any of them..now i noticed gamecreator and gamedeviancy got it as well and its hillarious ..hahaha .. you guys are sooo .

[DerRidda]

• F1 / Help uses hardcoded browser the user may not have (firefox) and will lock the editor if no previous instance is running I saw some documentation on xdg or something and my eyes just glazed over. Does anyone have a simple
  

 

It couldn't be easier. Just use xdg-open, it's a program. The man page speaks for itself http://linux.die.net/man/1/xdg-open

Open up a terminal and type 'xdg-open http://www.leadwerks.com' (http(s) is mandatory for URLs) for example, or any other URL, it will open in your default browser which in Unity can be configured in the control panel under "Information".

Do the same for any local file path, like a jpeg or pdf and it will also open that in the default app for that.

Should take you a minute to change.

 

• Mouse wheel doesn't work any where It doesn't work in the scene browser or asset browser. Slightly annoying but only that
  

The thing here is, some scroll bars like the one in the asset tree view, script editor and log window work perfectly fine with wheel scrolling. What differentiates those from the ones that break? An if they indeed are different and it can be done force the use of those everywhere else.

[marchingcubes]

The only slight problem with xdg-open is it needs environment variables set to bind it to the user's current desktop session..

 

It is likely those variables will be present in the shell that spawned Steam/Leadwerks, but depending on how you invoke the process, those variables may not be passed along.. and if they are not present xdg-open will fall back to its 'generic' mime database instead of invoking the gvfs-open/kde-open handler, which can cause confusion if you have set a default browser in your desktop environment but xdg-open has a different one in its 'generic' database of mime type handlers

 

e.g.

 

printenv | grep XDG

XDG_SESSION_ID=1

XDG_SESSION_COOKIE=1874c2ff359fcb03bb02ab5152dbcc09-1424239005.811223-1876517971

XDG_RUNTIME_DIR=/run/user/1000

[Guppy]

 

High priority

• Model editor rendering bug has now been reported to Nvidia here.
  

 

And what of AMD/ATI users ? remeber I've the exact same bug and I somehow doubt Nvidia will fix it for me

[arekkoz]

F12 (single viewport mode) not working I don't think this is critical, and the feature works really badly with GTK.

yes its not critical, because i can do everything without it

however it really make things like sculpting much harder, despite it may looks like

[Josh]

And what of AMD/ATI users ? remeber I've the exact same bug and I somehow doubt Nvidia will fix it for me

This is the first I have heard of this.

 

It couldn't be easier. Just use xdg-open, it's a program. The man page speaks for itself http://linux.die.net/man/1/xdg-open

Open up a terminal and type 'xdg-open http://www.leadwerks.com' (http(s) is mandatory for URLs) for example, or any other URL, it will open in your default browser which in Unity can be configured in the control panel under "Information".

Do the same for any local file path, like a jpeg or pdf and it will also open that in the default app for that.

Should take you a minute to change.

Okay, how do I do that programmatically on every user's computer?

[Guppy]

This is the first I have heard of this.

 

 

The very link in that nVidia post you made is of me reiterating that it's affecting AMD users, after you merged my bug report of the issue into the nvidia thread claiming it to be a nvidia issue... Maybe if you read the damn bug reports

[Josh]

It couldn't be easier. Just use xdg-open, it's a program. The man page speaks for itself http://linux.die.net/man/1/xdg-open

Open up a terminal and type 'xdg-open http://www.leadwerks.com' (http(s) is mandatory for URLs) for example, or any other URL, it will open in your default browser which in Unity can be configured in the control panel under "Information".

Do the same for any local file path, like a jpeg or pdf and it will also open that in the default app for that.

Should take you a minute to change.

 

It turns out all I actually had to do was change this code:

System("firefox "+url);

 

To this:

System("xdg-open "+url);

 

And it appears to work. The fix is up now.

 

The very link in that nVidia post you made is of me reiterating that it's affecting AMD users, after you merged my bug report of the issue into the nvidia thread claiming it to be a nvidia issue... Maybe if you read the damn bug reports

That attitude doesn't make me feel good about an operating system that already has ten times more little niggles and gotchas than Windows or Mac. I don't think you guys realize the disproportionate amount of problems I experience with Linux.

[gamedeviancy]

[RANT]

 

That attitude doesn't make me feel good about an operating system that already has ten times more little niggles and gotchas than Windows or Mac. I don't think you guys realize the disproportionate amount of problems I experience with Linux.

 

You do realize O/S X is unix based right? If Linux is too much trouble for Leadwerks development, than you might want to stick to just supporting Macrohard. I haven't been using the editor much as my game is mostly procedurally generated. I purchased the Leadwerks engine so I could jump right into 3D without having to learn open gl right away. The conversation regarding Linux on these forums is making me feel uneasy. I'm quite used to the sentiment that "Linux is hard, just buy Microsoft or Apple guys", but it still pisses me off to hear it, especially from 'programmers'. I think the engine is pretty cool and there are a lot of neat projects coming from it, but I am a Linux user and only a Linux user. So if support for the O/S is dropped or degraded any further, I'm going to ask for a refund so that I may spend the money on an open gl book instead...

 

[/RANT]

[DerRidda]

That's exactly what I meant, just replace Firefox with xdg-open. I sadly couldn't test that because somehow for me opening links hasn't worked for quite some time but if there is only one other Linux user saying that it generally works for him I consider that a system specific issue. (Might be that I'm encountering the issues marchingcubes mentioned with the STEAM_RUNTIME chroot.

 

Guppy, is the new link opening magic working for you?

 

 

Also, let's stop the grunting at each other here please. Yes, Linux has quirks Windows and OS X don't but also vice versa and some of these quirks get amplified by some the technology choices made for Leadwerks.

I wanted this to be the thread where we ignore that both ways and attempt to look for solutions based on what Leadwerks is now.

[Guppy]

 

That attitude doesn't make me feel good about an operating system that already has ten times more little niggles and gotchas than Windows or Mac. I don't think you guys realize the disproportionate amount of problems I experience with Linux.

 

*My* attitude?

I've been very calm and accepting of the myriad of bugs - even when the product is barely usable to me. I then point out (in response to your "that's news to me" remark ) that in the bug thread you merged that I no less than 3 times point out that I use AMD so it's properly not exclusive to nvidia.

Hell the link you posted to nvidia jumps directly to a post by me stating that the issue is happing on AMD.

 

I really don't believe it's out of line for me to suggest you've not read the bug report when you are surprised by it's contents.

 

But so be it I'll go back to silently wishing that one day my 200$ Kickstarter investment will pay off.

 

PS. Yougrove you publicly questioned why Linux users have not made a ruckus about the issues.. Are you still wondering?

[YouGroove]

I think Linux users are not enought people or not using LE3 in a serious project , at least they are not reactive or active on the forum.

Anyway , why don't Linux guys use something like Wine that can laucnh windows apps or am i totally wrong ? (i'm not Linux user until Win 10 will annoy me)

What matters is to be able to publish to Linux, whatever you made the game on Linux or Windows.

 

I won't start a famewar Windows Vs Linux LE3 users, but i have no idea of What Linux involves in LE3 about developement, only Josh knows.

It is as hazardous and make as much bugs as Android platform when it was supported ?

It is too much maintainance work compared to Windows and slowing down LE3 ?

I can't say i believe Linux will be great in LE3 soon or all graphic bugs will disappear quickly , but it's just seeing these Linux problems it seems it's hard and complicated.

[gamecreator]

There were 787 backers on Kickstarter, 318 of which pledged for the software itself (one of them for a 5-pack). They put up their money because of certain promises, the most obvious of which was to build Linux games, on Linux. Not on Wine.

 

I don't use Linux but the promises were clear to me and they deserve solid versions no less than we do for Windows.

 

That said, I was one of the people who bought both Android and iOS versions of Leadwerks (and a Nexus 7 so I can test the former) and they were soon discontinued. So I'm aware of how this isn't a fairytale world we live in and sometimes Josh strives for more than he can accomplish.

[marchingcubes]

YouGroove: I think there are plenty of us Linux users active on the forum.. These threads are obvious proof of that.

 

I think it's easy for these issues to turn into flamewars, and it is certainly true that building software that works seamlessly cross-platform is never all that easy - but as a Linux user, I too would appreciate software that works as it is supposed to.

[YouGroove]

Only trying some things ( like Android and Linux ) you learn it's not as easy as you thaught.

But perhaps Linux could get last problems resolved and encounter rares ones very problematic next time ? i can't estimate as i don't develop on Linux.

One solution sould be to turn Linux Editor Open Source, i mean you can make changes, but only Josh would decide what fixes or improvments to incorporate. Or hire a Linux developper if it is too much maintainance slowing LE3 again ?

 

This is simply software developement estimation , specially when you have not already developped on some specific OS , you can promise things, but it's at final hard to keep and lot more challenging or complicated than what you thaught.

It's current also on game developement to find promise or delays that at final can't be reach due to a bad estimation of the cost and work it involves.

 

Lastly Microsoft just took a game dev from a company to pass it to another , that things that happens.

A promising indie game small company hired indusrty guys to work on a game, but the costs was too much compared to their estimation the game would cost and the time it owuld need to be completed.So the game just get abandonned unfortunatelly.

 

Josh has done like any other companies, he has bet on some feature (Linux) without having experience enought or knowing how complicated it could get.

[Ronald Buanno]

That attitude doesn't make me feel good about an operating system that already has ten times more little niggles and gotchas than Windows or Mac. I don't think you guys realize the disproportionate amount of problems I experience with Linux.

 

You disappoint me every other week with some of your comments man. What kind of indie dev supporter are you really?

 

I'm gonna keep this constructive, and say good job for "programmatically" fixing the fire-fox issue...

 

I think it's easy for these issues to turn into flamewars, and it is certainly true that building software that works seamlessly cross-platform is never all that easy - but as a Linux user, I too would appreciate software that works as it is supposed to.

 

That might be partially because some users feel the need to post in a thread about an OS they do not use...

 

There were 787 backers on Kickstarter, 318 of which pledged for the software itself (one of them for a 5-pack). They put up their money because of certain promises, the most obvious of which was to build Linux games, on Linux. Not on Wine.

 

I don't use Linux but the promises were clear to me and they deserve solid versions no less than we do for Windows.

 

That said, I was one of the people who bought both Android and iOS versions of Leadwerks (and a Nexus 7 so I can test the former) and they were soon discontinued. So I'm aware of how this isn't a fairytale world we live in and sometimes Josh strives for more than he can accomplish.

 

Mmm, preach for me \o\ I can feel the wisdom shining off you!

[marchingcubes]

YouGroove: I'm not sure an open source editor would yield immediate benefits - I mean, this is commercial software we all paid for. If we wanted to develop our own editors, we would probably be doing that.

 

That being said, I would be interested in helping out if the editor was open source.

 

Personally, I am hoping things will improve quickly. For my purposes, Leadwerks on Linux has been easy and fun to use.. Possibly i'm the only happy Leadwerks Linux user, but at least theres one of us?

[codeape]

I am a happy Linux user too. I have had few problems with Leadwerks. I might not be the most active user on the forum but I am having fun with Leadwerks on Linux.

[Guppy]

I am a happy Linux user too. I have had few problems with Leadwerks.

 

Could you clarify please what that means? are these bugs not happening to you or are you just ignoring them?

 

Edit; I see you've listed Windows 7 as among'st your OS'es - I assume your using the editor from there?

[codeape]

Could you clarify please what that means? are these bugs not happening to you or are you just ignoring them?

 

Well I use the Editor for some things like creating prefabs and creating test maps for my hobby game creations. Most things I do are PCG though so I probably do not use all of the functionality of the editor (like terrain).

 

Edit; I see you've listed Windows 7 as among'st your OS'es - I assume your using the editor from there?

 

No, I do 99% of my stuff in vanilla Ubuntu 14 and only compile on Windows to test that my stuff works on both platforms. I have developed for Linux since 1998 so I am more comfortable with do things on Linux.

 

EDIT: Some clarifications on my editor usage.

[Ronald Buanno]

Dat Linux experience...