LE Community Project

[AggrorJorn]

The word choice of 'tech demo' isn't entirely correct I agree. What we ment is a simple demo level to show what the community is working on. You could call it a first-work in progress-pre-pre-pre alpha. We just went with tech demo because it was easier.

 

The project is very open towards its members. If you have input about a model, level or functionality in code, you can request or add them yourself. Everything we do or have done is registered in the forum. We did use a wiki, but due to poor communication it was no longer worth it to spend much time on it.:S

 

I know what you mean with wider audience when it comes to opensource projects (google code for instance). The thing is that I like to have a team who volunteers to work on the project. And although everybody who signs up is free to leave whenever he/she wishes , it does require some sort of commitment. When having a team you increase the level of motivation and that was a must during a project like this. With a team you can make a planning and set better targets then when just having the code out there and let people reandomly do stuff.

 

Like I expected it was not that easy to keep the project going. The first few weeks went okay because there was a lot of progress. But then slowly members started to stop working on it or responding to emails. Especially the last one is fatal for any kind of project. The months June and July where very silent and almost no progress was booked. August was a month full of changes and a large part of the work got done in those last few weeks. The last 4 weeks till the deadline, the team was reduced to 5 core members (me included).

 

As for the source and assets:

A poll within the team has lead to the outcome that both the source code and the assets will be free for personal and commercial use. Once the tech demo has been cleaned up a bit, we will release it to werkspace. Only requirement is recognition in the credits and a license from Leadwerks.

[AggrorJorn]

A new version has been uploaded to werkspace:

http://www.leadwerks.com/werkspace/files/file/365-midnight-salsa-game-source-assets/

 

The end

We have decided that the community project ends here. I am uploading the source code and the assets which can be used anyway people want. Since Leadwerks 3 is inbound we thought it would be smarter to end this project.

[macklebee]

crashes when pressing start:

looks like some gmf's and textures are failing to load along with a lua script error:

Warning: Failed to load mesh "zip::../lecp/lecp/assets/weapons/weapon_bat.wsp//weapon_bat_w.gmf": Mesh loader failed.

Lua error: [string "zip::.../lecp/lecp/assets.pak//assets/weapons/weapon_bat.lua"]:11: attempt to index field 'bat' (a nil value)

[Marleys Ghost]

Well mack ... you get a bigger screen than me lol

 

 

[Guest Red Ocktober]

fails to load after menu screen... spins for about 35 secs while loading a lot of stuff... then aborts...

 

from the engine log:

 

 

Warning: Failed to load mesh "zip::c:/users/mike hense/downloads/lecp game - project midnight salsa/assets.pak//assets/models/prop/small/emergencyintercom/prop_small_emergencyintercomlod1.gmf": Mesh loader failed.

 

 

Warning: Failed to load mesh "zip::c:/users/mike hense/downloads/lecp game - project midnight salsa/assets.pak//assets/models/prop/medium/urinoir/prop_med_urinoirlod1.gmf": Mesh loader failed.

 

 

Warning: Failed to load mesh "zip::c:/users/mike hense/downloads/lecp game - project midnight salsa/assets.pak//assets/models/prop/medium/ticketmachine/prop_med_ticketmachinelod1.gmf": Mesh loader failed.

 

 

Warning: Failed to load mesh "zip::c:/users/mike hense/downloads/lecp game - project midnight salsa/assets.pak//assets/models/light/ambient/light_ambientlod1.gmf": Mesh loader failed.

 

 

Warning: Failed to load mesh "zip::c:/users/mike hense/downloads/lecp game - project midnight salsa/assets.pak//assets/models/entities/environment/emitter/environment_emitterlod1.gmf": Mesh loader failed.

 

Warning: Failed to load mesh "zip::c:/users/mike hense/downloads/lecp game - project midnight salsa/assets.pak//assets/models/characters/zombiemale01/characters_zombiemale01_zombiemale01lod1.gmf": Mesh loader failed.

 

 

Loading sound ""...

Warning: Failed to load sound.

Loading mesh "zip::c:/users/mike hense/downloads/lecp game - project midnight salsa/assets.pak//assets/models/prop/small/cagelight/fixture_cagelightlod1.gmf"...

Warning: Failed to load mesh "zip::c:/users/mike hense/downloads/lecp game - project midnight salsa/assets.pak//assets/models/prop/small/cagelight/fixture_cagelightlod1.gmf": Mesh loader failed.

 

Warning: Failed to load mesh "zip::c:/users/mike hense/downloads/lecp game - project midnight salsa/assets.pak//assets/models/prop/small/exitsign/prop_small_exitsignlod1.gmf": Mesh loader failed.

 

Warning: Failed to load mesh "zip::c:/users/mike hense/downloads/lecp game - project midnight salsa/assets.pak//assets/models/prop/medium/barrier/models_prop_medium_barrierlod1.gmf": Mesh loader failed.

 

 

Warning: Failed to load mesh "zip::c:/users/mike hense/downloads/lecp game - project midnight salsa/assets.pak//assets/weapons/weapon_batlod1.gmf": Mesh loader failed.

 

 

Warning: Failed to load mesh "zip::c:/users/mike hense/downloads/lecp game - project midnight salsa/assets/weapons/weapon_bat.wsp//weapon_bat_w.gmf": Mesh loader failed.

Lua error: [string "zip::c:/users/mike hense/downloads/lecp game - project midnight salsa/assets.pak//assets/weapons/weapon_bat.lua"]:11: attempt to index field 'bat' (a nil value)

 

--Mike

[macklebee]

Well mack ... you get a bigger screen than me lol

 

 

 

yeah i get that too if i hit the reset button in the graphics menu... i had to completely delete the LECP folder then unzip again to make it a useable size again...

 

Red/

I think the zipstream loader has a bug as it will try to load LODs even if there isn't any for that particular mesh. The final warning you posted is the one I posted as well which refers to an actual gmf not LOD, and I think that is what is crashing the program...

[AggrorJorn]

thanks for the feedback guys. I missed a folder. :S

 

It is uploading the package.

[AggrorJorn]

The upload is ready. I hope it's the last one

[Benton]

Is there plans to make a LE3 version? Pathfinding will be a lot easier

[gamecreator]

There was a survey sent out asking if the project should be continued but I don't think that was one of the questions.

[AggrorJorn]

Is there plans to make a LE3 version? Pathfinding will be a lot easier

There isn't. I also would not recommend continuing this project as a next community project when using LE3. I think a fresh start is required to create a game with LE 3. Ofcourse your are completely free in porting the project to LE3 with pathfinding.

[AggrorJorn]

About the ending:

http://www.leadwerks.com/werkspace/blog/34/entry-966-the-leadwerks-community-project-ending/

[Marleys Ghost]

The upload is ready. I hope it's the last one

 

Did you add a cloaking device?

[Naughty Alien]

A new version has been uploaded to werkspace:

http://www.leadwerks...alsa-tech-demo/

 

The end

We have decided that the community project ends here. I am uploading the source code and the assets which can be used anyway people want. Since Leadwerks 3 is inbound we thought it would be smarter to end this project.

 

..why ? LE3 in initial form, will not be even up to knees of LE2.x, regarding graphics output, so if LE3 is a reason to stop, its look like wrong one..

[AggrorJorn]

@Naughty Alien. It has nothing do with the engine itself. It is about members wanting to try their own project and exploring LE3 and therefor spending less time or no time at all on the project.

 

This was polled within the lecp team and this was the outcome. most members didn;t vote on it, which shows more then enough that people are not interessted in the current project anymore.

[Guest Red Ocktober]

and this is exactly why i don't [didn't] join these [the] community project...

 

they very rarely succeed...

 

unfortunately i don't see this as a successful ending...

 

- you need to have one person as the visionary and lead developer...

- all team members must not only be excited about and share the vision, but must also be inclined to follow the lead developer, doing what he/she says...

- excuses should be kept to a minimum... timeframes should be adhered to...

- the lead dev must be open to suggestion and all members must be willing to accept harsh critique...

- there should be a minimum of work planning and unnecessary documenting...

 

without the above, the lecp was doomed to end up exactly as it did...

 

sorry guys/gals... not trying to be unreasonably hard on the team... it was a noble effort...

 

 

ok, the latest version...

 

finally got a chance to get in the game... splash screen doesn't hang around too long... nice ambient sounds during loading...

 

you still have to exit the app and restart once you get killed, else it looks like level loading errors will occur if you don't...

 

overall...

 

i was left with the impression that the game was flat... the splash screen was really bad... and, where was i at.. how did i wind up in this tunnel... and why were there zombies attacking me... what was my goal, was it to just kill as many living dead as possible... where was i headed...

 

play one of the demos from Frictional Games (Penumbra: Overture/Black Plague)... i consider these very well done indie efforts...

 

i expected the lecp to equal, and even surpass Penumbra...

 

(i can only call em as i see em... please don't kill me in my sleep )

 

--Mike

[Rick]

@LECP Team

 

I've said it before and I'll say it again, having some kind of working game with bugs or needed enhancements is better than having no game at all. Learning what it takes to "finish" a game and the vulnerability you can feel by putting it out into the world is an experience in itself that is only received by doing it. Practice makes perfect (even practice finishing and releasing something) and I'm proud of what everyone was able to contribute to the game.

 

Good job guys and let's learn from it and make another go sometime with LE3. Never give up, never be afraid of failure! Michael Jordan missed the game winning shot 26 times. The point is that he took them! You have no chance at being great unless you take them. So let's keep taking them guys and keep learning.

[Guest Red Ocktober]

unfortunately, if you don't learn from your failures, you're fated to repeat them... and doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results... well, you know what that's the definition of...

 

an objective, post mortem assessment would be worth a lot more than an atta boy cheer leading session...

 

it would be valuable to hear from the team as to what they've learned from the experience... what they might've done differently...

 

--Mike

[Pixel Perfect]

All in all, given the timescales and the fact that the team had never worked together before I think you did quite well and certainly better than any Leadwerks Community Project in the past which from memory failed to produce any playable content. I'm sure valuable lessons have been learnt by all contributors.

 

It's a shame but, with LE3 on the horizon, it was always going to be questionable whether you'd get the input you needed by continuing with the project.

[shadmar]

As Aggror stated, communication was difficult, also most communication was veery async, so timespan between decitions took days instead of seconds if we were all in the same room.

So I agree with Mike, it's shallow no doubt, has one monster type, you can kill, and a thin ending, it has menus .. but all in all it's playable (wouldn't call it a game, but a short demo)

But I learned alot, so it was totally worth it, for my part. I didn't excpect it to really finish with the pace we had.

[AggrorJorn]

@mike: I understand your point of view. The 'game' is even for a demo/tech demo/showcase not all that spectacular. We never set out to create a commercial game nor a fully completed game.

 

Even so, comparing it with a top notch game like Penumbra or Amnesia is really overkill. The team that we have is not fulltime dedicated to this game and that wasn't a requirement. Just pitch in were you can and if that is only the first few weeks, then thats fine as long as you communicate that to us.

 

I made very clear to the members that I didn't want to have a story or complete game plan. That was never the goal we set out to do. Just seeing how far we could go as a team, that was the idea. Game ideas can get so complex within minutes that it is essential to keep yammering about the fact that we should keep it simple.

 

There is no reason why the player is where he is. What has happened, why the monsters attack, what your goal is. That was never really the purpose. It is something to take in consideration.

[Josh]

Penumbra started as a tech demo with no story. I played the original one.

[Guest Red Ocktober]

also, in all fairness, Penumbra Overture (2006) is exactly the type game that anything done (along the zombie killing lines) in Leadwerks is going to be compared against by the general public...

 

and it was done by two or three people... so again, it's not a stretch to compare it to the lecp...

 

keep in mind, this is a constructive post mortem ... i am not doing a critique or a game review... if it seems overly harsh i apologize in advance, that is not my intention...

 

because of the purely objective approach i take this may seem like i'm ripping apart the team efforts, but that i am most certainly not trying to do...

 

--Mike

[AggrorJorn]

Don't worry about it. We know you are good leadwerks member.

[Pixel Perfect]

also, in all fairness, Penumbra Overture (2006) is exactly the type game that anything done (along the zombie killing lines) in Leadwerks is going to be compared against by the general public...

 

and it was done by two or three people... so again, it's not a stretch to compare it to the lecp...

--Mike

Penumbra Overture was produced by a core team of four people who also used additional resource for some of the music, artwork and programming. They were working full time on the project and it took nearly 10 months. Maybe you are thinking of the original tech demo that Josh referred to which was simply called Penumbra!

 

Besides, these guys had already written an engine together and were used to working as a team before they even embarked on Penumbra.