YouGroove Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 Are PC/Linux features and editor priorities or will mobile platform come back ? In that case would it be Low hardware renderer option or only for big Android palatforms for example ? Quote Stop toying and make games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DudeAwesome Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 http://www.leadwerks.com/werkspace/topic/7091-leadwerks-3-faq/page__hl__faq Quote It doesn´t work... why? mhmmm It works... why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YouGroove Posted March 27, 2014 Author Share Posted March 27, 2014 How much it was Ouya bakers ? caus Android is stopped from 3.1. ----------------------------------------------- I find something to correct : Which version of OpenGL does the engine use?3.0 usesOpenGL 2.0. OpenGL 4.0 is supported as of 3.1 It seems OpenGL4 minimum now. Quote Stop toying and make games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppy Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 How much it was Ouya bakers ? caus Android is stopped from 3.1. What makes you say that? Quote System: Linux Mint 17 ( = Ubuntu 14.04 with cinnamon desktop ) Ubuntu 14.04, AMD HD 6850, i5 2500k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DudeAwesome Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 Check Out the kickstarter link on each leadwerks Page yougroove Quote It doesn´t work... why? mhmmm It works... why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YouGroove Posted March 27, 2014 Author Share Posted March 27, 2014 What makes you say that? We don't talk mobile and Android forum is just inactive. But well perhaps it will come back in the year ? Quote Stop toying and make games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beo6 Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 i would come back to the android forum when there would be something usable. But for the moment it is Joshs decision to not work on mobile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 For the time being, I am focusing on PC and Linux, because this has shown the strongest response. Quote My job is to make tools you love, with the features you want, and performance you can't live without. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppy Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 We don't talk mobile and Android forum is just inactive. The android forum is "protected" - kickstarter backers cant see it. At any rate it seems you were right - Josh decided to kill off android support Quote System: Linux Mint 17 ( = Ubuntu 14.04 with cinnamon desktop ) Ubuntu 14.04, AMD HD 6850, i5 2500k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YouGroove Posted March 29, 2014 Author Share Posted March 29, 2014 Well ... Depends on your Android game level graphics, but you can for now simply use other free and non free 3D engines, that offers optimisation prooven and advanced controls and systems. It's better having LE3 strong one day and shine in PC/Linux with features implemented (grass/tree system, CSG tools etc ... Multiple platforms means, bugs , otpimisation , new mobile support to develop etc ... it can be too much and will only slow down main platforms. Quote Stop toying and make games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gamecreator Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 This is a messy issue that I imagine Josh isn't comfortable with. He sold people like me Android and iOS packages only a year ago. I know it's difficult on his end because sales didn't meet his projections but at the time he continued to go forward with it (to finish it and fix bugs) instead of offering refunds. It seems a little late now to just drop it. I know I personally bought a Nexus in large part for this and of course I spent hours figuring things out and trying prototypes. So I don't know what to say, really. I think Android and iOS users should be entitled to a credit at least if Josh would like to wash his hands of mobile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DudeAwesome Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 Well when Android/iOS is dropped I really have to think about if I should invest more money and time here 1 Quote It doesn´t work... why? mhmmm It works... why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YouGroove Posted March 29, 2014 Author Share Posted March 29, 2014 I had some refund proposition, but i didn't wanted it, i thaught let's this be some contribution to help make better LE3 Engine. Contribution, even open source donation is a good thing , caus it helps things evolve. For mobile, you have big concurrents, even offering great stuff for some 200$ or even for free all mobile solution : from virtual customizable controls ready to use, lot of optimisation tricks and system already implemented for you ... why going LE3 ? I'm not sure it could be a good strategy if there is no demand, caus bug fixing fro every problems , improving it, bringing new versions etc ... will cost lot of time and only delays all other platforms. Sometimes, it's better do one or two things very well than a lot and not so good. The demand has changed a lot, majority of people asked high PC standards, and particulary Deffered system , real time shadows, effects etc ... than Linux people wanted Leadwerks 3. So this remains the priority for now. I also prefer to see coming CSG tools , grass etc ... on PC. But well , who knows mobile in LE3 could return some day if Leadwerks 3.1 would be polished enought complete, we'll see. Quote Stop toying and make games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 There are two big problems: First, there is a huge disparity between mobile and PC graphics. This causes a lot of problems and discontinuity Second, mobile is extremely slow and difficult to develop for. Mobile has taken about 80% of my time spent debugging things, and has accounted for less than 10% of revenue in the last year. Nvidia's new Tegra chips can run regular OpenGL 4.4 (not ES) so we may see convergence between mobile and PC graphics in the future. That would make it much easier to deliver a consistent experience across the board, and remove the need to write and maintain two separate renderers. There is a stretch goal for OUYA/Android support that was met. SteamOS was announced after this campaign ended, and I think it's a much better direction to go in than the OUYA. I am discussing that with the backers. So far they seem to understand the need for this, and are pretty supportive of it. Even if I have to issue a few refunds, I think this is the right decision to make. (The alternative is to not make any decision, which means slower development, fewer new features, and more bugs.) It may make sense to pursue mobile at some point, but not right now. Linux gaming has gotten really popular since the campaign, so I think putting all resources into the desktop and living room is the best direction to go in. 5 Quote My job is to make tools you love, with the features you want, and performance you can't live without. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neseir Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 Hi I have purchased 3.0 for both PC and Android version and was looking forward to the OUYA support. But during the time and changes in both the game-engine and the supported plattforms (or planned supported), I support the decision made by Josh. I would rather like to have all effort in further developing/optimizing the PC/SteamOS/Linux editions rather then burning a lot of time on the mobile platforms. Both are as I understand it not generating significant revenue and requires a lot of tweaking and GLES 2 support and will not provide the same level of features as supported (and appreciated) on the OpenGL 4.x supported plattforms. OUYA support should be replaced with e.g. the SteamOS. I have an OUYA and reading all the comments and reviews, it looks like I'm the only one using it regulary and purchasing games. What I have noticed is (as all owners of an OUYA have probalby) that it is seriously underpowered to support most modern gameengines. The games that works well do not use to much effects and fancy graphics/physics but focus on gameplay. Putting even the old 3.0 editions on the OUYA is probably too much for the hardware to get started with and more light-weigth gameengines (preferrable 2D based) should be considered. Looking forward to the comming release of the 3.1 editiion for Linux (and later SteamOS support ). Regards Eirik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panz3r Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 I am sorry but simply dropping the mobile too harsh. If Leadwerks 3.0 would not have had mobile support i would not have bothered to buy it and i would not have acquired a second license trough kickstart. While I can understand that too many platforms are hard too maintain please consider supporting at least one mobile platform, preferable android. I consider for my project (space mmo) that mobile is a key part . BTW this is one the reasons why I want source code, if developer give up on supporting then at least you have a chance on fixing stuff yourself. After i spent this time learning, prototyping and developing suddenly mobile support is dropped. The only acceptable proposal in my opinion is to provide source for 3.0 to the people who bought mobile if mobile support is dropped. Otherwise i doubt anybody else except hobbysts with small projects and steam people will touch it, 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 panzr, I sent you a message. Quote My job is to make tools you love, with the features you want, and performance you can't live without. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panz3r Posted March 29, 2014 Share Posted March 29, 2014 I have been offered as well refund but I refused because I am glad I could help linux (and Leadwerks) community. To be fair i did not put all the eggs in the same basket and i had 3 parallel implementations (with 3 different engines) for my project so I can work with other 2 (server side is where the heavy lifting part stays). However , "never say never" so we will see Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tournamentdan Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Lies, lies, lies and more damn lies. You certainly have some of the worst business ethics I have ever come a crossed. You decided to support mac and linux so you could increase your potential end users. So why are you taking potential end users from us? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 You decided to support mac and linux so you could increase your potential end users. So why are you taking potential end users from us? The end users voted with their wallet. I don't like the lack of mobile in 3.1 but I don't know how anyone can't understand the situation. Basically nobody bought the mobile versions compared to the Linux versions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gamecreator Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 It could also be argued that mobile wasn't pitched to the same extent Linux was but that's more a hunch than anything. I don't know the numbers. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tournamentdan Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 [/size][/font][/color] The end users voted with their wallet. I don't like the lack of mobile in 3.1 but I don't know how anyone can't understand the situation. Basically nobody bought the mobile versions compared to the Linux versions. A lot of people did not buy the mobile add on because (A) the main engine lacked features. Why would you spend extra money when the engine lacked enough features to create a game? (b)You really do not need to export to a mobile device until you start to get to the end of production. Last time I checked, game creation can take a good bit of time to create a game start to finish. So there is no need to buy a export add on until you get farther in the game creation. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naughty Alien Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 ..this situation seems to be rather identical or very similar to crossroad between LE2.x Leadwerks 3.x, when existing user base asked for desktops(WIN/Linux/OSX) what was rejected in favors of mobiles..deja vu.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tournamentdan Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 ..this situation seems to be rather identical or very similar to crossroad between LE2.x Leadwerks 3.x, when existing user base asked for desktops(WIN/Linux/OSX) what was rejected in favors of mobiles..deja vu.. Yeah. Its a disturbing recurring occurrence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted March 30, 2014 Share Posted March 30, 2014 Tournamentdan, you are dealing with a 1 man show here. A small shop. They have to be supported differently than a big shop or an engine that already has been established in that specific field (mobile in this case). They can't afford long development cycles by game devs in order to make their money. So when Josh spends lots of time and effort on mobile and you plan on making a mobile game then you need to support that right away or this is what you get. If you don't want to do that (which is your right) then you have to go with an already established mobile engine that already went through the pain of starting up. My simple little mobile game that I made in about a month paid for my copy of LE mobile. Sometimes you have to do things that aren't your dream game to pay the bills. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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